Our company uses phases for each building that we build, and it is time consuming when we have to create 4 change orders to the owner just because we have to make changes to each subcontract that will effect each phase, please make it so that we can add more than 1 phase onto a change order and more than one phase on the subcontracts so that our subcontractors will not need to sign paper work for each building they will be doing work on. This would make life a lot easier on us, the subcontractors and most of all on the owner that will no longer have to look at 5 change orders for the same work to be done on every building. I know I am not alone on this one.
by: Ashley S. | over a year ago | Project Management
Comments
Yes - this should apply to Change Orders, Purchase Orders, etc. Move the "Phase" entry to the job distribution line item or the PO line item, etc., instead of the Header Record.
Agree....there needs to be a (1 to many) database relationship for phases. we have the same issue when we have phases set up for each floor of a single project and a client asks us to price a single PR, which affects every floor of the building. it is not possible to keep it Apples-to-Apples on job costs reports, so we have had to compromise and make ALL CHANGE ORDERS to a single phase call change orders!...this does not work and we wish we could assign phases in the grid as oppose to the header section of the change order screen...this way the sell side and the budget/cost side of the change order can be applied to the budgets correctly. This is a huge improvement if this can be achieved.
Both CHANGE ORDERS and SUBCONTRACT module screens need the phase in the GRID/DETAIL....not on the Record/up-top!
Actually...Correction....CHANGE ORDERS + SUBCONTRACTS + PROGRESSIVE BILLINGS all need phases assigned in the GRID....this way, any change order can be "pulled" into progressive billing as well, the same way it would into Subcontracts.
Does anyone know how to make this more relavent? This is a huge issue and "could be" a huge value improvement, but no one seems to see this post or may not understand it.
SCENARIO:
A subcontractor is awarded a contract. they go into sage, set up the phases (1st floor labor, 2nd floor labor, 3rd floor labor,etc...), then applies an estimated budget to these phases.
When costs come in, the job costs get applied to the respective phase, cost code and cost type....all is good....
The PM can compare the "original" budget to the JTD cost...great...
...BUT THEN the subcontractor gets asked to price a "single" CPR (Change Proposal Request), which affects every room in the building and all floors (these are our phases)....
So, they estimate it (may not be thru Sage but rather a 3rd party estimating system)....the client approves this CPR and it now part of the contract. procedural methods may differ from company-to-company on how and when any particular company interacts with Sage....)
So, now the subcontractor would enter this CPR into the change order module (6-4-1), but realizes Sage has never considered that a "single" CPR can affect multiple phases (a one-to-many relationship)....so the subcontractor has 2 choices:
1) create just x1 record in the 6-4-1 screen.
- PROS = PM only creates x1 record in sage,
- PROS = the client reports and thier own internal staff reporting, clearly shows x1 summaried record for the CPR and it's assoicated status
- CON = the subcontractor is forced to apply the estimated budgetted cost of this CPR, "all" to just x1 phase
- CON = this destroys the function of the Estimate vs Budget reports b/c costs are now apple-to-oranges.
- CON = Limits the PM's ability to manage costs (per phase) and forcast.
2) create a record "for each" phase the CPR affects.
- PROS = PM is able to breakdown costs per phase and apply it to the Estimated Budget, per phase.....thus allowing Job Costs reports to clearly compare apples-to-apples.
- PROS = PM maintains the ability to manage costs (per Phase) and forcast.
- CON = multiple records for a single CPR must be created.
- CON = multiple records end up, clouding the reports, rendering them non-effective.
- CON = any reports intended to be scheduled and sent as an update to end-user clients will be broke down into multiple line items, confusing the client, as they only understand it as x1 CPR.....not multiple CPRs.
SUMMARY:
As you can see, neither of these options truely works for the subcontractor.
The Subcontractor should not work around the software, rather, the software should be designed to work for the subcontractor.
it is our recommendation that the PHASE, be moved from the (6-4-1) screen's table and embedded into the grid or the line items...allowing the subcontractor to maintain a single record for the CPR, while also allowing the subcontractor to be able to apply estimated budget to each respective phase, as needed.....which in turns, corrects cleint reporting, PM reporting and Budget-to-JobCost analysis.
This would be a huge improvement for subcontractor which have larger, more complex projects, where change orders sometimes become a larger overall portion of the project than the originating base contract.
Agreed. Been requesting this for over a year myself. I'm curious if anything has moved forth with it. I see it being requested on here over different request. This will save a lot of time for the PMs, vendors, admin, subs and field supervisors.
There is an Add-on product that we use with Change Orders from ZoomGeeks called ZMax One-Click, where it allows access to the Phase in the grid. Then you run the ZMax One-Click process and it creates separate Change Orders for each phase, removes the revenue and cost budget from the "Parent (original CO record)" and places them in the "Child (newly created CO record). It works really well, but I don't think you can use it with purchase orders. I agree embedding it in the grid from the start makes the most sense, as we also have a lot of trouble with it being included in the header.